This is a really good match to get an education about wrestling! I watched this months ago and immediately thought that the Ref overplayed his hand and over-reacted in his calls. But I've watched this many times since, and I can see just what he was calling.
Admittedly, you can say the fleeing call is pretty subtle, but I think it was the right one. And the stalling (now that I study it) is very obvious - the wrestler in white just rode the blue wrestler's hips the entire round. If you are not making progress toward turning your opponent, including not moving to a position perpendicular to the bottom man, that is stalling. And if you are being overpowered by your opponent, that also is not stalling - in this case, the white singlet was clearly far heavier than blue, and clearly was using that weight advantage to hold down the blue opponent.
Gutsy calls by the ref. And because it WAS the State Semi-finals, they SHOULD have been called: IMO, the Ref applied the correct interpretation of the rules in a situation where it really mattered.
The flee call was text book, in my opinion, The bottom guy finally gets to his feet and as he is trying to turn and face the top guy shoves him out of bounds to avoid giving up the the escape point. As to the stalling, the top guy never came off the hips even when he put a half-hearted half in. If you will notice at the very end of the match, with the top guy now behind in the score, he then comes off the hips and sincerely tries to turn the bottom guy. I watched the match in person and I agreed with the calls at the time and the more I watch the video the surer I am that the correct calls were made.
From my vantage point the first call for stalling was iffy at best. granted we did not get top see the entire match so there had to be a stall call previous to the one at 1:20 in the third. I really didn't see alot of action from the top man until he ran the half hearted power half right before the stall call. As for the bottom man it is difficult to base up when the top man is covering both hips. As for the fleeing the mat call I would not have called it that time(assuming it was the first time). I would have spoken to both wrestlers briefly told them to keep it clean. If it happened again I would then call it. If it had happened previously and i had spoken to them then yeah I MIGHT have called it. I disagree with the fleeing the mat call
oldman and fan, I love it that you're so passionate about wrestling! It means alot that hopefully fans from Texas are boosting the level of wrestling around the nation. Now if we could just get those fans updated on the rules, we'd have an upper hand.
Fan, have you never heard a whistle blown before wrestlers go out of bounds? Have you ever been in a gym where there's a mat against a wall, or where 2 mats go almost circle to circle? Officials will often times stop action on one mat before they impede on another. So to say 'the fact is that they don't blow the whistle BEFORE they go out of bounds' just shows you might need to get out and see a few matches. But looking at your enthusiasm, it shouldn't be a problem...
Fleeing cannot HAPPEN after the whistle, but it can be CALLED after the whistle.
Catman, your explanation on the flee call doesn't cut it. Refs may try to blow the whistle as quickly as possible, but the fact is that they don't blow the whistle BEFORE they go out of bounds. And, wrestling is DONE when the whistle blows. Fleeing CANNOT be called for actions AFTER the whistle blows. The ref decided this match. It wasn't the worst of the day though. Go watch the 180lb final.
The point about the whistle blowing before the flee call is understandable. However, the officials typically try to blow the whistle as quickly as possible on out of bounds situations, then administer the call as soon as it is obviouse both wrestlers are safe. This appears to be what happened in this situation as well. I truly see that the kid in white on top literally hunkered down and threw the bottom kid out of bounds to prevent a possible escape or switch.
Love the comments! Thanks matref0, WOW and Alegre... The only excuses I've seen here from people on the fact that the flee should NOT be called is "too much is at stake", "rides the kid the entire period" etc. So because this is a semi-finals match, then the flee call should NOT be called right? How about 'let the kids decide the match' theory? Well, they did, the kid in white DECIDED to dump the bottom kid out of bounds, so letting the kids decide the match DID happen - great idea!
WOW you ask why stallin was not called on the bottom wrestler? Because the top guy was stalling by not turning or coming off the hips - even you said it 'rides the kid the entire 3rd period', but you never mentioned 'create action' 'work for the fall' 'comes off the hips' anything.
Alegre my resume would top about anyone's... This season I completed my second year of youth officiating and was lucky enough to be an assistant on a consolation quarter finals match for the JV side of a big JR High tournament, how's that? One of these days I'm gonna make it to the semi's on the bottom side of the bracket, I can smell it!
The stall call was legit and you can hear his coaches telling his kid what to do to avoid stalling. The bottom wrestler is overpowered by the top wrestler riding and putting on a pinning combination that wouldn't turn anyone and never got off the hips. I think it was a good stall call.
IMO the fleeing the mat call was suspect. I think most would have called that out of bounds in that situation.
Classic example of how Officials decide matches in Texas. This kid is up 1-0 going into the last period, rides the other kid the entire period and loses because a Texas Ref decides he must be the center of attention and decide the outcome of the match - Flo refers to it in several of these matches by saying "That's the way they do it down here in Texas" - code words for the REFS HAVE NO CLUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Horrible, horrible, horrible. The ref put himself in the match and decided the "winner". The bottom guy was spread eagle almost the whole period. Where was his stalling call? Listen close on the fleeing the mat at the edge. The whistle blows BEFORE the wrestler in white throws the other kid.
Ok Catman (haha), we can go resume to resume any day. At 1:20 a stall call was MADE, typically a wrestler is warned before the call is made (I didn't see it which is why I asked in the other post). However, I understad that we didn't get to see the whole match as coverage started a lil late so it's possible the warning took place earlier. And as for the coach, it appears as if he asks for an explanation as opposed to make the oppurtunity known to the ref of what is at stake for his kid. Anyway, all I am simply saying is that at this stage of the game you gotta let the kids wrestle it out. As for fleeing the mat, I also understand but this is a semi-finals match, once again too much is at stake. Well thanks for the input. Regardless, it is what it is.
Evidentally these posters don't know much about the rules. There is a warning at about the 1:20 mark, and then a call was fleeing the mat towards the end, great call as the HWT in white took action out of bounds. The coach did fight for his kid, but the call was not overturned, correctly.
That ref blew the match for the El Paso kid. Did anyone see a stall warning? From what I saw the guy on bottom didn't do much either (which is typically expected from HWT), subsequently he was awarded two points and the win for nothing. I am saddened that the Eastwood Coach didn't put much of a fight for his kid!
Mohammed Usman, Arlington Bowie v Eddie Noriega, El Paso Eastwood
Admittedly, you can say the fleeing call is pretty subtle, but I think it was the right one. And the stalling (now that I study it) is very obvious - the wrestler in white just rode the blue wrestler's hips the entire round. If you are not making progress toward turning your opponent, including not moving to a position perpendicular to the bottom man, that is stalling. And if you are being overpowered by your opponent, that also is not stalling - in this case, the white singlet was clearly far heavier than blue, and clearly was using that weight advantage to hold down the blue opponent.
Gutsy calls by the ref. And because it WAS the State Semi-finals, they SHOULD have been called: IMO, the Ref applied the correct interpretation of the rules in a situation where it really mattered.
Fan, have you never heard a whistle blown before wrestlers go out of bounds? Have you ever been in a gym where there's a mat against a wall, or where 2 mats go almost circle to circle? Officials will often times stop action on one mat before they impede on another. So to say 'the fact is that they don't blow the whistle BEFORE they go out of bounds' just shows you might need to get out and see a few matches. But looking at your enthusiasm, it shouldn't be a problem...
Fleeing cannot HAPPEN after the whistle, but it can be CALLED after the whistle.
WOW you ask why stallin was not called on the bottom wrestler? Because the top guy was stalling by not turning or coming off the hips - even you said it 'rides the kid the entire 3rd period', but you never mentioned 'create action' 'work for the fall' 'comes off the hips' anything.
Alegre my resume would top about anyone's... This season I completed my second year of youth officiating and was lucky enough to be an assistant on a consolation quarter finals match for the JV side of a big JR High tournament, how's that? One of these days I'm gonna make it to the semi's on the bottom side of the bracket, I can smell it!
IMO the fleeing the mat call was suspect. I think most would have called that out of bounds in that situation.
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