113 LBS HIGH SCHOOL RANKINGS

Akins beat Gromacki 2-1 and Cullen 4-2 at NWCA Scholastic Duals yesterday

Jason Boss-
I don't think you can use common opponents to determine who is a half a notch above who. Is it safe to assume that your half a notch comment is referring to regular decision victories? The names mentioned above, getting major decision, tf or pin would be rare for sure.

I think what's even a more important factor is how does the top 5 finish at national events with other national ranked wrestlers, HMs or an extremely solid bracket compete compared to the next group. Russell wins NHSCA with Fleetwood in the bracket. Valencia wins Ironman with Assad, Hayes, Fuentes, Singh, Tucker and etc in the bracket. Fleetwood wins Escape the Rock with Fuentes and Lizak in the bracket.

Jason Boss-
I don't think you can use common opponents to determine who is a half a notch above who. Is it safe to assume that your half a notch comment is referring to regular decision victories? The names mentioned above, getting major decision, tf or pin would be rare for sure.

I think what's even a more important factor is how does the top 5 finish at national events with other national ranked wrestlers, HMs or an extremely solid bracket compete compared to the next group. Russell wins NHSCA with Fleetwood in the bracket. Valencia wins Ironman with Assad, Hayes, Fuentes, Singh, Tucker and etc in the bracket. Fleetwood wins Escape the Rock with Fuentes and Lizak in the bracket.

Jason Boss-
I don't think you can use common opponents to determine who is a half a notch above who. Is it safe to assume that your half a notch comment is referring to regular decision victories? The names mentioned above, getting major decision, tf or pin would be rare for sure.
I think what's even a more important factor is how does the top 5 finish at national events with other national ranked wrestlers, HMs or an extremely solid bracket compete compared to the next group. Russell wins NHSCA with Fleetwood in the bracket. Valencia wins Ironman with Assad, Hayes, Fuentes, Singh, Tucker and etc in the bracket. Fleetwood wins Escape the Rock with Fuentes and Lizak in the bracket.

Willie Saylor-
Far enough. Fleetwood was already ranked above Lizak so your point is valid and no dispute on that front. Lazik lost to Evan Fidelibus in January and then Lizak avenged the lose twice in February.

keep in mind, lizak lost at least twice this year (off the top of my head) including one to fleetwood

meluv -
good observation on your part and default was probably a poor choice of words on my part. To clarify my point and answer both questions, the saying goes that 50% of life is showing up. 5 of the top 7 showed up last weekend and were in the finals. It also takes a body of work to really assess a wrestler. There are too many variables to go on a single match.The body of work also shows how close that top group is to each other. The only body of work he is afforded is at these events. A win over #3 and losses by an eyelash to 1,3, and 5, as well as other recent significant wins puts him rightly in that top group. In Piccininni's case, if the were fellow top 10 wrestlers at a tournament at a given place and time, wild horses couldn't keep him from showing up and wrestling. If one of them showed up at his door at 3 am, he would roll out of bed and into his wrestling shoes. This is what makes it such a pet peeve of mine that the elite NY wrestlers cannot show up and get this opportunity during the season, which far supercedes offseason results.
As far as who comes to wrestle in any match or tournament, I feel it's important to keep the frame of mind that it is an opportunity for the wrestlers who want to be a part of it, first and foremost. If some one declines, I don't feel like the reason is any of my business so I never ask. In this context with other criteria being essentially equal, I just tend to give the nod to who is there. I should have phased that differently.

Beating the dead horse, NY wrestlers do not have permission to wrestle the tournaments during the season that the other state champs go to. If so, all the elite NY wrestlers would be at BOE, Ironman, etc and there would be no questions on it. To find competition that appears on the rankings they have to travel off season at their own expense. Even then there is no guarantee the other wrestlers will show up. You can only beat the guy who steps up and shakes your hand. The Fleetwood - Piccininni match never happened. Fleetwood was scheduled to travel to the Pinning Down Autism Duals but was a scratch the day before. I would argue that Piccininni jumps him by default but the difference between 6 and 7 among guys who never wrestled each other is splitting hairs.

Yourkid Isbetterthanmykid,
I haven't seen any results that show Piccininni vs Fleetwood match, so I can only assume the match didn't happen. I could care less what state a wrestler is from, I'm all about results only.

I think the problem with proud states like NY who feel they aren't getting the respect they deserve is that they don't look at big picture when it comes to results. For example, you mentioned Piccininni defeating a 3rd place state finisher from NJ. Piccininni is a NY State Champ, post results of him beating other state champs, that carries more weight than defeating a 3rd place finisher.
Rankings used to be objective and they still are to a point but seem to be leaning more to being subjective. Since you brought up Piccininni, I'll use him as an example. Prior to Flonationals, he was ranked #10 so i'm going to use that as the starting point. He attended Flonationals and didn't beat a ranked wrestler and jumped to #7 or up 3 spots. He did beat a wrestler that Willie previewed as finishing #3 but that wrestler is probably on Willie's HM list. So my question to Yourkid Isbetterthanmykid, how does a westler job 3 spots on the ranking board by being runner-up at Flonationals and not beating a single ranked wreslter? If Piccininni had won the tournament and beat another ranked opponent, then I can see an argument for him moving up 3 spots. I'm thinking that Willie is impressed with Piccininni and feels (subjective) that he's better than the wrestlers Piccininni jumped and therefor moved him up the rankings. Does Piccininni have to beat only state champs and ranked wrestlers to move up, no, but a good start would be to win events like FloNationals.
I'm like Willie in the regards that I think Piccininni is a very solid wrestler and I think he's a tough competitor, so I have the uptmost respect for him and his talent regardless what state his from.

meluvwrestling 4 weeks ago
Did they end up wrestling eachother and if so, what was the result?
Piccininni wound up beating the 3rd place NJ finisher, a good wrestler named Vindici. He won in really convincing fashion, 9 - 0. This assumes that you're willing to be convinced that the NY kid is one of top 113 guys in the country. If you're like most folks who comment around here, you probably think NY high school wrestling falls somewhere between Guam and Alaska.
http://www.flowrestling.org/speaker/16838-Nick-Piccininni/video/700699-113-lbs-match-Nick-Piccininni-NY-vs-AJ-Vindici-NJ

I can't wait to hear the explaination on how Boston jumped 8 spots based on a single "FLO" tournament.

Low weights are harder to rank. Most people aren't fully developed below some random weight around 115 lbs. For example: A girl won MA states this year at 106. I don't think a girl could ever be the best wrestler above say 120 lbs. Maybe I'm just ignorant or stupid but I believe what I just wrote.

Gotta tip my hat to whoever does these rankings. Boston was a teeny weeny better than Piccicinni this past weekend and you have them ranked back to back. Impressive!

My only criticism is that they should both be further up the list. Perhaps 2 and 3 or 3 and 4?

Why isn't Jarred Ganger (113) from Troy Christan in Ohio not ranked? He has beaten #8 Johnny Jimenez (120) this past summer at fargo 120, #2 Matt Kolodzik (120) last year in district finals at 106 and also #5 Sean Russell at 106 at iron man. He is a State Champion and State Runner up and is a Sopre.

Why isn't Jarred Ganger (113) from Troy Christan in Ohio not ranked? He has beaten #8 Johnny Jimenez this past summer at fargo (120), #2 Matt Kolodzik (120) last year in district finals at 106 and also #5 Sean Russell at 106 at iron man. He is a State Champion and State Runner up and is a Sopre.